Stay In Your Own Backyard

In a recent comment on the blog, “In My Father’s House,” our own “Ark” wrote this (in part) related to religion in the public domain:

Simply keep it out of the public domain. Schools, Government, local councils, saying prayers before sports matches etc., over meals at public or company functions ( where non believers are among the staff etc)

I started to write a response comment, but decided to devote a blog post to what I had to say. Here is what I was going to write:

Awoman to that!

I would add … worship your god all you want in your home, in your church, in gatherings with like-minded people, at the bedside of the sick, etc., etc. But please! Out of respect and deference to those who do NOT believe in your god (this includes people of other faiths as well as those with no faith), keep your beliefs within your own community.

I’m aware of your “Leader’s” instructions to reach out to the non-believer, but I daresay you will derive far more results/satisfaction through one-on-one meetings. Further, can you truly say that putting crosses on hillsides, “Jesus” signs on your lawn, religious messages on cars, billboards, government property, etc., or offering prayers at public events is going to “win the world for Jesus”? In truth, all it does is puff up your own sense of Christian virtue.

In case someone wants to make the claim that I’m seeking a secular-only world, this is not my intent. I’m just a firm believer in the strict division of church and state.

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45 thoughts on “Stay In Your Own Backyard

  1. Bravo Nan and Ark! BRAVO!

    I whole-heartedly agree! And despite popular faith-claims that the USA is and was founded as a Christian nation, is unequivocally wrong. Closely and intimately study ALL Founding Fathers, including their personal letters of correspondence to friends, family, and colleagues, and it is very clear… we were founded by law to keep separate religion and state for the mere fact that the entire human race (and Nature!) is unimaginably DIVERSE! Our government cannot possibly accomodate every belief system.

    But that addresses only ONE aspect of our 241-year federal history. 😦

    There is that nagging, persistent, delusion that specific faith-groups believe “God” has given them exclusive sovereignty over their community, state, region, nation, continent, and yes… even the planet. Ask them WHERE this sovereinty comes from and you’ll get a ridiculous number of differing and opposing explanations. And that’s just the funny part! The placebo-effect and peer-assimilation are two very, very powerful (deceiving) neurological agents. These two factors — along with many others — can show just how gullible and vulnerable every human psyche can be, yes? No one person, no one group is immune… no matter the circus we orchestrate.

    And THAT is why thriving (not just tolerated, but embraced!) diversity hedges against tyranny and/or theocracies!

    Liked by 5 people

    • Professor, you know and I know … it’s just like so many other things. When something is repeated often enough and widely enough, people (as a general rule) begin to see it as fact.

      The principle of church-state separation is an excellent example!

      Would that more people would read this article for a more accurate understanding of what the founding fathers actually believed and wrote about “Christianity.”

      But alas. The chances of that happening are remote, at best.

      Liked by 4 people

      • Indeed Nan. That article is a very good one! A great starting place actually for the more comprehensive picture of the birth of our nation. And it wasn’t just the Founding Fathers either, it has been several Supreme Court decisions as well. If I may toot my own horn please, I’d like to add to your mention of that article awhile back you’re familiar with:

        http://wp.me/p1uLmp-2jL

        I hope that with time reason and cumulative consensus of science prevails, if not here in the U.S., then with the rest of the world.

        Liked by 3 people

  2. Wally is on his bike yelling I want to legislate against ”Faith”?
    How on earth I would do this is beyond me, unless everyone had to be lobotomized.

    I once worked for a real estate firm, the owners of which were Christian. No sweat.
    However, on the first company ‘do’ I attended – end of year awards thingy – the owners, husband and wife stood before the meal was served and asked everyone to bow their heads in prayer to thank god for the food we were about to eat and also for the sales done in the year and to pray for bumper sales in the new year.
    I did not know the religious make up of the employees but everyone that I could see bowed their head.
    Well … all but one.
    As the prayer was under way -and i was quite a long drawn out thing much to my surprise – I became aware of a piercing look from a middle-aged women at our table who hissed:
    ”Charles ( the boss) likes everyone to bow in prayer!”
    ”Does he really?” I replied, and continued to admire the architecture of the restaurant.

    Liked by 6 people

  3. I’ve long been of the opinion that religious people plastering their symbols all over everything in the public square are doing the same thing as a dog peeing on a tree. They’re just marking their turf.

    Liked by 6 people

  4. Great post! I’m not a fan of organized religion, but the prayer thing at company events is ridiculous! I recently attended a alumni event for my college, of which I was a board member at one time. It was their annual event, and a person got up and gave a long prayer, I just looked straight ahead. I can’t believe how many people were giving me the stink eye because I didn’t bow my head. After the prayer, all of the people at the table I was at were still giving me dirty looks. Really?? I left shortly thereafter.

    Liked by 3 people

  5. Well said, Nan and Ark. Unfortunately, they won’t heed the advice. We either have a democracy or a theocracy, but we can’t have both. Which one do they want? Their actions speak volumes.

    ” “The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”
    ― James Madison (1803)

    Conservative Christians are nauseously invasive in public places in the South and spreading through out the country. This receipt is from Sonic Drive In, which is corporate.

    To avoid this going into moderation, I’ll post the next image with a comment from the Christian who posted it on FB. This receipt is from a Sonic in Mississippi — you know — the most religious state in the country, consistently ranking last with regard to social ills.

    Liked by 3 people

  6. This incident happened at a city council meeting last July in Florida, to make a point that if Christians continue to push prayer in public places — continue to blur the boundaries between church and state, then they better make room for other non-Christian groups. Of course, as you will see in this 2 minute clip, the Christians got their panties in a wad.

    Liked by 3 people

  7. Why do we pussyfoot around religion? The purpose of keeping religion out of our politics is that it is tribalistic poison, a definition of a false separation of “them” and “us.” It isn’t enough that we have physical differences and behavioral differences to focus on when dividing “us” from “them,” but not we have “invisible friends” differences, too. (I am reminded of Conan and his sidekick sitting around a campfire debating which of their gods would kick the other god’s ass in the first Schwarzenegger Conan movie. Isn’t this what we have sports for?)

    Separate and eradicate, I say. We used to say everybody had a right to smoke, now we say in is a disgusting habit. We can do this, people.

    Like

  8. ” (this includes people of other faiths as well as those with no faith), keep your beliefs within your own community.”

    Well Nan, I have a problem with what you say here… If I didn’t share my faith with those who don’t yet believe…I wouldn’t be doing as Jesus Christ instructed His disciples, with His last spoken words before ascending into heaven…

    Matthew 28:19-20… Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” (ESV)

    Since I am here to please God, and not man (Galatians 1:10)…I will do my best to share my faith every time the Holy Spirit places someone in my path… Today that would be U and UR friends !!

    God, please draw one of these dear readers in…John 6:44…and urge them to open, understand, and obey the following link…

    Blessing to all,

    bruce

    http://godsmanforever.com/2014/10/26/the-truth-about-sin-10262014-by-bruce-reposted-from-7112013/

    Liked by 1 person

    • Oh joy, oh joy! Bruce has paid a visit to my blog. How lucky can I get???

      @Bruce,

      Allow me to point out something I wrote in this post — I daresay you will derive far more results/satisfaction through one-on-one meetings.

      Let me make this even clearer and more pointed … attempting to convert people by using this blog is not acceptable and if you continue to “share your faith,” I will be forced to moderate your comments. You are free to “go therefore and make disciples” anywhere else you wish (and are allowed), but NOT on this blog. Got it? Good!

      Like

  9. Will Bruce Godsmanforever at least acknowledge the rebuke? I doubt he will. as ‘one-on-one meetings’
    will complicate his desire to fulfill Jesus Christ’s wish to “make disciples of all nations”. Mission Impossible, but worth a try….
    .-
    .

    Liked by 1 person

  10. Hey nan, just an observation.

    While you abrade people for simple praying because unbelievers may be around, ie, meals, sporting events, etc, and you think there should be laws preventing such, riddle me this.

    The same freedom that others enjoy to express their speech, is the same freedom that others find repulsive during daily conversation regarding pornography, same sex marriage crapola, and a thousand other things, so wake up will ya.

    Just think of prayer as conversation you do not like, and grow a spine. Be tolerant, as others tolerate perversity and whatnot. Deal?

    Like

    • “Just think of prayer as conversation you do not like, and grow a spine. Be tolerant, as others tolerate perversity and whatnot. Deal?”

      CS: In the video Victoria posted in this thread, could you note the time stamp where Christians were being tolerant began, so we could follow their example.
      Thks. Appreciate ya.

      Like

    • @CS —

      You accused me of saying there should be laws preventing such. WRONG! I did not say anything about laws.

      Further, you are referencing “conversations,” which are far different that public events. If I’m in a store, on a bus, etc. and I hear others “speaking Christian,” I’m not justified to say anything. It’s their “right” — just as it’s MY right if I choose to discuss pornography, same sex marriage, or other “crapola.”

      My point is Christians are NOT going to make any in-roads with non-believers by pushing their faith in the public arena. If they truly want to “win souls for Jesus,” they should do it one-on-one with someone who is interested in what they have to say. Case in point — how many souls do you think you’ve won by pushing your beliefs/faith on atheist blogs?

      Like

      • Of course plume victoria would pick the extreme view. Par for the course. She also said Paul the apostle was mentally challenged.

        Sure. Go ahead and be just like her. lol

        By the way, the vid is pathetic on so many levels; don’t even know where to start.

        Like

        • What do we know about Paul? From Acts 9:1 ” And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,

          2 And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.

          Nice guy, eh? So according to your bible, this is someone who has no compunction about brutalizing people who didn’t believe the way he did. What happens next? He had a vision and heard a voice, and then went blind for several days.

          If you ask a neurologist what they thought about those symptoms they’d probably say they were evidence of a structural event [damage] in the brain. Brain damage doesn’t improve over time. It can cause personality changes, auditory and visual hallucinations, and so on. If I’m not mistaken, he also claimed to continue to have visions for many years. In the probability of things, Victoria’s explanation is very plausible.

          At BEST he was a self confessed psychopath who abused innocent people. As for the video, just find the one biggest pathetic thing out of all the many pathetic things and share that with us. Keep in mind, I’ve watched the video and all I see are tolerant people being quiet and supportive out of respect for someone else’s beliefs.

          Oh wait.

          Like

        • That’s right plume. Kinda gives his life context eh?

          Read the epistles and decide if he was a lunatic. I dare you to find fault with his unsurpassed intellect.

          Jealousy is not becoming. The again, you probably never heard of grace and truth…………

          As I have told others, you can never, Never, NEVER win an argument against God and His word. As if you can sink a submarine with a peashooter.

          You will die of breathlessness. lol

          Liked by 1 person

        • You can take off your ego hat now, as you were only right to recall that SAUL of Tarsus, and not PAUL the apostle, breathed out threatenings………….

          Context is a bitch.
          Glad to help remove the fog from your mind.

          Like

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